3B getting better?

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pythons007
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3B getting better?

Postby pythons007 » Mon Jan 30, 2012 7:38 am

Has 3B gotten better in the past month adding Hanley Ramirez and with all the rumors of Miguel Cabrera? I can't see anyone using Ramirez at 3B when he still has SS eligibility, however once he does gain that position it makes him eligible at 3 positions.
How would you rank the 3B field now?
Cabrera
Bautista
Longoria
H. Ramirez
Beltre
Wright
12 team Roto
C Kelly
1B Bellinger
2B Hiura
3B Rendon
SS Baez
OF Betts
OF Robert
OF Buxton
UTIL Guerrero Jr.
UTIL Santander
BN McCutchen, Hampson, Robles

SP Lynn, S. Gray, Morton, S. Sanchez, Means, El. Hernandez
RP Pomeranz, W. Smith, Montero, Bradley

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Oregon Nut Cups
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Re: 3B getting better?

Postby Oregon Nut Cups » Mon Jan 30, 2012 7:52 am

I'd say you have it right, though Grey's rankings has Wright over Beltre:

http://razzball.com/top-20-3rd-basemen- ... -baseball/
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Re: 3B getting better?

Postby JoeC » Mon Jan 30, 2012 1:24 pm

I think Grey's wrong ranking Wright above Beltre. I think most people are underestimating how good a season Beltre had last year:

487 AB, .296 BA, 32 HR, 105 RBI, 82 R

That's a pretty amazing line considering he missed about 6 weeks of time due to a stupid Rangers medical staff that allowed him to return too soon from a pulled hammy (returned after 2 weeks out and then re-injured it and was out an additional 4 weeks).

With a full season of at-bats (around 600), I see Beltre with a line something like .310 BA, 38 HR, 125 RBI, 95 R. That, in my opinion, puts him behind only Bautista and Miggy at third base (yes, that means ahead of Longo and HanRam).

I'm pretty sure he'll be my 2nd round pick everywhere this year.

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ChrisV82
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Re: 3B getting better?

Postby ChrisV82 » Mon Jan 30, 2012 8:06 pm

With a full season of at-bats (around 600), I see Beltre with a line something like .310 BA, 38 HR, 125 RBI, 95 R. That, in my opinion, puts him behind only Bautista and Miggy at third base (yes, that means ahead of Longo and HanRam).

I'm pretty sure he'll be my 2nd round pick everywhere this year.
All due respect, that's crazy. The last time Beltre hit over 32 homers before last season was in 2004. Dude will be 33 when the season starts. He's also a career .276 hitter, not to mention he sports a career .329 OBP, so I'm not sure where that average is coming from (or the runs).

You are more optimistic than Bill James over a slow footed rookie slugger.
I like sports with balls in them.

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Re: 3B getting better?

Postby RandomItalicizdVoice » Mon Jan 30, 2012 8:16 pm


With a full season of at-bats (around 600), I see Beltre with a line something like .310 BA, 38 HR, 125 RBI, 95 R. That, in my opinion, puts him behind only Bautista and Miggy at third base (yes, that means ahead of Longo and HanRam).

I'm pretty sure he'll be my 2nd round pick everywhere this year.
Way WAY too optimistic, IMO.

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Re: 3B getting better?

Postby JoeC » Mon Jan 30, 2012 11:48 pm

All due respect, that's crazy. The last time Beltre hit over 32 homers before last season was in 2004. Dude will be 33 when the season starts. He's also a career .276 hitter, not to mention he sports a career .329 OBP, so I'm not sure where that average is coming from (or the runs).

You are more optimistic than Bill James over a slow footed rookie slugger.
Crazy crazy? Or crazy like a fox? :D

I don't think you can put too much stock in his career average or home run history. His offensive output was suppressed while he was in Seattle. I put more stock in recent history than that which is further back. In Boston in 2010 and Texas in 2011, he's simply a different hitter and the bar has been raised. Having a real lineup around him certainly doesn't hurt.

My forecast is simply a repeat of last year but with a full slate of at-bats.

Chris, we'll have to settle this in an RCL league. That's the only way!

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Re: 3B getting better?

Postby RandomItalicizdVoice » Wed Feb 01, 2012 9:41 pm

Beltre (from FantasyAlarm):

Only two seasons in which he has hit .300.
Only two seasons with 30 homers.
Only three seasons with 100 RBI.
Only once season of 90 runs scored.
Only one season with an OBP over .360.
Only two seasons with an OPS over .900.
To compare...
Miguel Cabrera has hit .300 with 30 homers, 100 RBI and 90 runs scored each of the past two years.
Michael Young has hit .300 seven times.
Josh Hamilton, and his drug and injury limited career has hit 30 homers twice.
David Ortiz has 100 RBI six times.
Austin Jackson has played two big league seasons, and both times he has scored 90 runs.
Adam Dunn has posted an OBP of .360 seven times.
Pablo Sandoval already has two seasons with an OPS of .900 in just three full seasons in the big leagues.

pythons007
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Re: 3B getting better?

Postby pythons007 » Thu Feb 02, 2012 8:57 am

Beltre (from FantasyAlarm):

Only two seasons in which he has hit .300.
Only two seasons with 30 homers.
Only three seasons with 100 RBI.
Only once season of 90 runs scored.
Only one season with an OBP over .360.
Only two seasons with an OPS over .900.
To compare...
Miguel Cabrera has hit .300 with 30 homers, 100 RBI and 90 runs scored each of the past two years.
Michael Young has hit .300 seven times.
Josh Hamilton, and his drug and injury limited career has hit 30 homers twice.
David Ortiz has 100 RBI six times.
Austin Jackson has played two big league seasons, and both times he has scored 90 runs.
Adam Dunn has posted an OBP of .360 seven times.
Pablo Sandoval already has two seasons with an OPS of .900 in just three full seasons in the big leagues.
So what does all that mean? You're comparing 7 different players to one, and techically only 2-3 play the position he plays. If you're saying he won't do the .300 30 100 you could have stopped after your explaination of his career, but you completely lost me with the additional of everyone else's stats.
12 team Roto
C Kelly
1B Bellinger
2B Hiura
3B Rendon
SS Baez
OF Betts
OF Robert
OF Buxton
UTIL Guerrero Jr.
UTIL Santander
BN McCutchen, Hampson, Robles

SP Lynn, S. Gray, Morton, S. Sanchez, Means, El. Hernandez
RP Pomeranz, W. Smith, Montero, Bradley

RandomItalicizdVoice
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Re: 3B getting better?

Postby RandomItalicizdVoice » Thu Feb 02, 2012 9:29 am

Beltre (from FantasyAlarm):

Only two seasons in which he has hit .300.
Only two seasons with 30 homers.
Only three seasons with 100 RBI.
Only once season of 90 runs scored.
Only one season with an OBP over .360.
Only two seasons with an OPS over .900.
To compare...
Miguel Cabrera has hit .300 with 30 homers, 100 RBI and 90 runs scored each of the past two years.
Michael Young has hit .300 seven times.
Josh Hamilton, and his drug and injury limited career has hit 30 homers twice.
David Ortiz has 100 RBI six times.
Austin Jackson has played two big league seasons, and both times he has scored 90 runs.
Adam Dunn has posted an OBP of .360 seven times.
Pablo Sandoval already has two seasons with an OPS of .900 in just three full seasons in the big leagues.
So what does all that mean? You're comparing 7 different players to one, and techically only 2-3 play the position he plays. If you're saying he won't do the .300 30 100 you could have stopped after your explaination of his career, but you completely lost me with the additional of everyone else's stats.
As I mentioned...just quoting from another site.

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Re: 3B getting better?

Postby JoeC » Thu Feb 02, 2012 9:59 am

Only two seasons in which he has hit .300.
Yes, but one of those seasons was 2010 and he nearly hit .300 last year (.296). Again, recent performance trumps career averages.
Only two seasons with 30 homers.

Again, one of those 30 homer season was last year and in 2010 he hit 28. I would be shocked if he doesn't hit 30 home runs this year, especially given the park he plays in.
Only three seasons with 100 RBI.
And two of those seasons with 100 RBI were 2010 and 2011.
Only once season of 90 runs scored.
He was close in 2010 with 84 runs scored and definitely would've crossed that barrier if he had a full slate of at-bats in 2011.
Only one season with an OBP over .360.
I didn't predict OBP, but this looks to be wrong as he had an OBP of .388 in 2004 and an OBP of .365 in 2010 (not to mention hitting .360 OBP exactly in 2000).
Only two seasons with an OPS over .900.
Yes, but one of those was in 2010 (.919) and he came very close last year as well (.892).


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